by Jamie
With the recent passing of Chuck Berry I had a loose idea in my head. As I read piece after piece on his importance to the rock n’ roll form, I wondered what would be the records selected to create the ultimate starter pack on rock music? Meaning, if there was a Rock n’ Roll 101 class being taught at universities (which many do in fact have) what, say 50 records would be on the syllabus? What 50 records would represent the entirety of the canon and scope of rock’s first (almost) 70 years? Attempting to do it all in 50 picks you’d have to be incredibly strict to not have overlap and wasted, redundant picks. You’d want to show everything, scratch every surface that we’ve heard. Hard, but I managed two lists, both doing the same thing but not repeating one pick on either. I’ll present them below and sit anxious to see what others think.
Up in the morning and out to school, the teacher’s teachin’ the golden rule…
1950s (8)
Bo Diddly, Bo Diddley (1958)
Jerry Lee Lewis, Live at the Star Club, Hamburg (1964)
Chuck Berry, The Great Twenty-Eight (1982)
Little Richard, The Specialty Sessions (1990)
the Rivingtons, Liberty Years (1991)
Buddy Holly and the Crickets, The “Chirping” Crickets (1957)
Eddie Cochrane, 12 of His Biggest Hits (1960)
Wanda Jackson, Rockin’ With Wanda! (1960)
1960s (13)
The Everly Brothers, Heartaches and Harmonies (1994)
Phil Spector, Back to Mono (1958-1969) (1991)
Dick Dale and His Del-Tones, Surfer’s Choice (1962; 2006 deluxe edition)
James Brown & His Famous Flames, Live at the Apollo (1963)
The Graham Bond Organization, The Sound of ’65 (1965)
The Impressions, People Get Ready (1965)
Martha & the Vandellas, Dance Party (1965)
The Who, Meaty, Beaty, Big, and Bouncy (1971)
the Beau Brummells, Introducing the Beau Brummells (1965)
Bob Dylan, Bringing It All Back Home (1965)
Beatles, Revolver (1966)
Sly and the Family Stone, A Whole New Thing (1967)
Laura Nyro, Eli and the Thirteenth Confession, (1968)
1970s (11)
The Stooges, Funhouse (1970)
Curtis Mayfield, Curtis (1970)
Booker T & the MGs, Melting Pot (1971)
Roxy Music, For Your Pleasure (1973)
King Crimson, Red (1974)
Autobahn, Autobahn (1974)
Lee Perry, Super Ape (1976)
Bad Brains, Black Dots (1979/1996)
Suicide, Suicide (1977)
the Bar-Kays, Money Talks (1978)
Wire, 154 (1979)
1980s (11)
Killing Joke, Killing Joke (1980)
Liquid Liquid, Slip In and Out of Phenomenon (2008)
Metallica, No Life ’Til Leather (demo, 1982)
Venom, Black Metal (1982)
the Clash, Sandinista! (1981)
Flipper, Generic (1982)
Style Council, Our Favorite Shop (1985)
Janet Jackson, Control (1986)
Schoolly D, Saturday Night! The Album (1987)
Candlemas, Nightfall (1987)
Mudhoney, Superfuzz Bigmuff & plus Early Singles (1988)
1990s (5)
Ride, Nowhere (1990)
Bikini Kill, Bikini Kill (EP) (1992)
Suede, Dog Star Man (1994)
Ice Cube, The Predator (1992)
Refused, The Shape of Punk to Come: A Chimerical Bombination in 12 Bursts (1998)
2000s (2)
Portishead, Third (2008)
Swans, The Seer (2012)
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Alternatives:
1950s (6)
Sister Rosetta Tharpe, Complete Recorded Works Volume 1 (1938-1941) (1996)
the Coasters, 50 Coastin’ Classics (1992)
Elvis Presley, Elvis Presley (1956/2011 Legacy Edition Reissue)
Gene Vincent & His Blue Caps, Bluejeans Bop! (1956)
Johnny Kidd & the Pirates Complete Johnny Kidd (1994)
Billy Lee Riley, Red Hot: The Best of Billy Lee Riley (1999)
1960s (13)
the Ventures, Walk Don’t Run: The Best of the Ventures (1990)
the Crystals, He’s a Rebel (1963)
Sam Cooke, Ain’t That Good News (1964)
the Beach Boys, Shut Down Volume 2 (1964)
Barbara Lynn, The Jamie Singles Collection (1962-1965) (2008)
the Byrds, Mr. Tambourine Man (1965)
Rolling Stones, Aftermath (1966)
James Carr, You Got My Mind Messed Up (1966)
MC5, ’66 Breakout (1999)
Sagittarius, Present Tense (1968)
Desmond Dekker and the Aces, Action! (1968)
the Meters, Look-Ka Py Py (1969)
C.A. Quintet, Trip Thru Hell (1969)
1970s (12)
James Brown, Sex Machine (1970)
Jimi Hendrix, Band of Gypsys (1970)
Gil-Scott Heron, Pieces of a Man (1971)
the Kinks, Muswell Hillbillies (1971)
Black Sabbath, Vol. 4 (1972)
Brian Eno, Here Come the Warm Jets (1974)
Neu!, Neu! ’75 (1975)
the Who, Quadrophenia (1973)
Big Star, Third/Sister Lovers (1975/1978)
Pere Ubu, Terminal Tower: An Archive Collection (corrected reissue) (1985)
the Congos, Heart of the Congos (1977)
Richard Hell & the Voidoids, Blank Generation (1977)
Public Image Limited, Metal Box/Second Edition (1979)
1980s (10)
Orchestral Maneuvers in the Dark, Architecture & Morality (1981)
Discharge, Hear Nothing See Nothing Say Nothing (1982)
the Smiths, The Smiths (1984)
Swans, Cop (1984)
Ministry, The Land of Rape of Honey (1988)
Slayer, Reign in Blood (1986)
the Jesus and the Mary Chain, Barbed Wire Kisses (B-sides and More) (1988)
Public Enemy, It Takes a Nation of Millions to Hold Us Back (1988)
Green River, Dry as a Bone/Rehab Doll (1987)
Boogie Down Productions, Criminal Minded (1987)
1990s (6)
PJ Harvey, Rid of Me (1993)
the Boo Radleys, Giant Steps (1993)
Tricky, Maxinquaye (1995)
Beck, Odelay (1996)
Boards of Canada, Music Has the Right to Children (1998)
Nine Inch Nails, The Fragile (1999)
2000s (2)
At the Drive-In, Relationship of Command (2000)
Jonny Greenwood, There Will Be Blood (soundtrack) (2007)
Click on names for archives
Writers/Founders
Well Jamie, this was a fantastic idea and you have followed through with a commanding, discerning and relatively eclectic presentation. I am fairly useless to offer commentary and/or alternate choices after the midway point of the 1980’s, as by that time my focus was exclusively opera, classical music, film soundtracks with a sprinkling of jazz. Obviously in the case of film soundtracks my knowledge never abated and continues right up until the present day. I completely understand why you’d mention Johnny Greenwood’s score, and I do admire you really cutting to the bone, but I’d add some others from the last two decades like the Cave and Ellis music for The Assassination of Jesse James.
Rock albums like these would compete for my own Rock 101 list. Mind you I fully understood what you accomplished above, steadfastly resisting any hankering to name albums from various soloists or groups that would in a sense come off as repetitious. My list below is nothing more than albums I love and feel should at least “qualify” for any Rock 101 listing. I did not mentions a number of titles I would have had that not been already on your two lists:
What’s Goin On? (Marvin Gaye)
Pet Sounds (The Beach Boys)
Who’s Next? (The Who)
Aqualung (Jethro Tull)
Thick As A Brick (Jethro Tull)
A Passion Play (Jethro Tull)
American Pie (Don McLean)
Tapestry (Carole King)
Sgt. Pepper’s Lonely Hearts Club Band (The Beatles)
The White Album (The Beatles)
Abbey Road (The Beatles)
Rubber Soul (The Beatles)
Here’s Little Richard (Little Richard)
Muddy Waters: The Anthology – Muddy Waters
Blue (Joni Mitchell)
The Band – (The Band)
Deju Vu (Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young)
Bridge Over Troubled Water (Simon and Garfunkle)
Bookends (Simon and Garfunkle)
Night Beat (Sam Cooke)
Chronicles (Creedence Clearwater Revival)
Bayou Country (Creedence Clearwater Revival)
Green River (Creedence Clearwater Revival)
London Calling (The Clash)
The Queen is Dead (The Smiths)
Astral Weeks (Van Morrison)
Harvest (Neil Young)
The Wall (Pink Floyd)
Ziggy Stardust (David Bowie)
Imagine (John Lennon) I favor it over Plastic Ono Band album.
Rolling Stones (Sticky Fingers)
Rolling Stones (Beggar’s Banquet)
Arthur (Kinks)
Lola vs. the Powerman (The Kinks)
The Doors (The Doors)
LA Woman (The Doors)
Led Zeppelin II (Led Zeppelin)
Led Zeppelin IV (Led Zeppelin)
Highway 61 Revisited (Bob Dylan)
Blood on the Tracks (Bob Dylan)
Songs From the Key of Life (Stevie Wonder)
Innervisions (Stevie Wonder)
The Sun Sessions (Elvis Presley)
Kind of Blue (Miles Davis)
Bitches’ Brew (Miles Davis)
Otis Blue (Otis Redding)
Kid A (Radiohead)
Something/Anything (Todd Rundgren)
In the Court of King Crimson (King Crimson)
The Kick Inside (Kate Bush)
X/0 (Elliott Smith)
Either/Or (Elliott Smith)
A Tramp Shining (Richard Harris)
Songs of Leonard Cohen (Leonard Cohen)
Born to Run (Bruce Springsteen)
The Everly Brothers – The Everly Brothers (1959)
Crying (Roy Orbison)
Goodbye Yellow Brick Road (Elton John)
Disraeli Gears (Cream)
Graceland (Paul Simon)
Call Me (Al Green)
Otis Redding Sings Soul (Otis Redding)
Both Sides Now (Judy Collins)
All Things Must Pass (George Harrison)
This Year’s Model (Elvis Costello)
First Take (Roberta Flack)
Killing Me Softly (Roberta Flack)
The Complete Recordings (Robert Johnson)
Howlin’ Wolf (Howlin’ Wolf)
Synchronicity (The Police)
Mr. Tambourine Man (The Byrds)
Turn! Turn! Turn! (The Byrds)
There are plenty more, but for now I’ll stand with these.
Of course many of these were considered, but, as you note my aims are quite a bit different than naming ‘great records’ for possible inclusion (such a list, you probably contain over 10,000 records—no joke). Plus, some of the records you list I don’t even like THAT much; Carole King’s best work is her songwriting work for those great girls groups IMHO, and someone like Laura Nyro has records that both predate TAPESTRY and are more personally charged in a genre (singer songwriter) where that end is largely the point. Oh, and THE WALL; I’d take 10 Pink Floyd’s over it, so, yeah. I don’t even like THE WALL if I’m being totally honest; as I’m in the Syd Barrett/David Gilmour camp over Roger Waters for their discography.
Either way, many of these records above I love (and considered), but yeah, I had a lot different aims. I could go down the exhaustive list and say where that movement or sound was shown in my list, but you’d already know a good many of these because your knowledge of that 60’s era is good.
I will say on one of your picks—Todd Rundgren’s SOMETHING/ANYTHING—I nearly had his A WIZARD A TRUE STAR on the second list, as it’s one of the more important works of the form. ‘Zen Archer’ is one of the mediums great tracks.
If you don’t know that Graham Bond LP I have on my first list (and this is sort of to Tony as well), I’d recommend getting it, or spinning it online at least once. It’s nearly impossible to not have it on such an enterprise as it could be, seriously, one of the 5 most important records made in rock history and it’s largely unknown in America. It would, by itself, cancel out about a quarter of your list as redundant, it’s that far reaching in the content/style/sound/purpose that would dominate rock for the next several decades.
You are not the only one I have encountered that isn’t a fan of THE WALL, but I remain quite fond of that album myself and like it best of the Pink Floyd canon, though I like plenty more of their work too. Carole King’s greatest work for me remains TAPESTRY, but fair enough. We are largely in agreement throughout here. 🙂
Either way, if you wanted to show the thrilling excitement of rock n’ roll THE WALL and TAPESTRY should probably be avoided. I sorta get why you left the form now…
lol, just kidding.
🙂 🙂 🙂
Lucille insists that this is the best Pink Floyd album here:
I saw that you added the first two Byrds albums Sam. I think The Notorious Byrd Brothers and Younger Than Yesterday LP’s are far superior to either of those. I’m wondering what your thoughts are on those two albums.
Maurizio, do you like BYRDMANIAX? It was lambasted upon release, so all the creators ran from it like the plague, but listening to it decades later I don’t see the terribleness of it. In fact, on a good day I think it’s something of a masterpiece (granted, in spots) in the genre ‘Great Bands Worst Records’. It’s certainly being regarded as bad compared to other Byrd’s works (which is unfair, those are some of the greatest records ever made), but several of the tracks are tremendous—’Tunnel of Love’ is throbbing and glitzy schmaltz, while ‘Citizen Kane’ would’ve made a great double single with the Kinks’ ‘Celluloid Heroes’, but best of all is the satire drenched, ‘I Wanna Grow Up To Be a Politician’ which I wore out during our most recent campaign debacle, err, season.
Love both Maurizio but didn’t want to hAve a Byrds overload. The first you name competes with Mr Tambourine Man for their greatest album.
I like a few songs on Byrdmaniax, but it’s probably my least favorite with Farther Along.
When it comes to The Byrds, I would go… 1. Notorious 2. Yesterday 3. Fifth Dimension 4. Sweetheart 5. Tambourine Man 6. Ballad Of Easy Rider 7. Dr Byrd 8. Turn Turn Turn 9. Untitled 10. Byrdmaniax 11. Farther Along
Maurizio, my rankings of Byrds records would look pretty similar. I’d add that pretty much everything in your top 8 is a masterwork. Just a great band.
Do you know Euphoria’s THE GIFT OF EUPHORIA? A lost country-rock classic from 1969. I don’t even know if it’s in print anymore.
I have not heard of that album.
Do this
and this
and you’ll be pretty much hooked.
Wow these songs are incredible. Thanks for the heads up.
The first song you added World sounds like a mix of Oar by Skip Spence, Dillard And Clark, and American Beauty era Grateful Dead. Really good stuff.
Your reference to Dillard and Clark shows a great ear; one track in particular sounds essentially like a lost track of theirs;
Elliott Smith’s wrenching “Waltz 1” from his landmark “X/0” album is sheer perfection, chromatic bliss and a song as deeply moving as any ever written:
Marathon efforts from both Jamie and Sam. No way I could authoritativeky match either listings.
But I would add these for the 60s:
Monterey Pop – Live Album from the Monterey Music Festival 1967
Jimi Hendrix – Electric Ladyland (1968)
Elvis Presley – From Elvis in Memphis (1969)
I thought long about Hendrix as he was such an innovator and so highly influential. I’m, however, of the opinion that that early feedback excursions, and the evocative beauty with which he played them has over time seen (sort of remarkably) little influence (granted, you could take a lot of the 4AD stuff as Hendrix influenced, same for Cure’s DISINTEGRATION). A statement as much to his inimitable talent as to how noise from a guitar evolved. In my opinion MC5’s ‘Black to Comm’ and the Who’s ‘Anywhere, Anyhow, Anywhere’ have had longer family trees than Hendrix’s stuff in similar veins (similarly, the Monterey Music Festival, I’d read as the Who’s coming out party over Hendrix’s, even if their collective buzz was very similar afterwards). But, I do put Hendrix’s BAND OF GYPSIES in one of my lists, so I see that as a highly important statement (I sort of think had Hendrix lived, he’d have made records that were like Jeff Beck’s BLOW BY BLOW meets Curtis Mayfield’s SUPERFLY. Which, damn, is a glorious thought), even if I’m always careful not to take the ‘black band’ over the ‘white band’ which was starting to happen in Hendrix’s inner circle at the time of his life. The Experience are a band with view peers in the form.
I like reading the 70’s as starting when Hendrix laid down ‘Machine Gun’ on January 2, or 3rd (or whenever he did) 1970. It’s how I’m starting the Seventies in my Rock History Book.
If I was going to add an Elvis record after his initial Fifties heyday, it would be something akin to what you list here, even if I slightly prefer his Stax stuff of the early to mid 1970s (his ‘Promised Land’ is tremendous). Though, if you look at how rapidly rock started to move after the initial 50’s boom, Elvis’ records aren’t THAT necessary in such an exercise. Which, again, doesn’t slander a God, rather, says more at my aims with this specific endeavor.
So Jamie can you elaborate a little more on your criteria? No more than one selection per artist/band? Did you try to identify a certain album from a genre/subgenre that represented the beginning of a movement? Would like to understand more. Like what was your thought process to pick say Shut Down Vol. 2 over Pet Sounds. Or The Fragile over The Downward Spiral? And, you’re saying what albums represent the entire scope of rock, not necessarily that these are the 50 greatest rock & roll albums?
Yes, the criteria was to try and show everything rock has offered, or at least attempt to scratch the surface on its many movements in only 50 records. Now, this doesn’t necessarily mean only one 1 artist, but, it hurts your chances to accomplish this end if you start doubling up picks with redundant records. Thus, I sought originators of certain things that sometimes did multiple things within a record.
Thus, if you look at the second list (since it contains both questions you have) you start to see the method: SHUT DOWN VOL. 2 helps me broach 2 styles—It has the classic car/surf rock of their earlier stuff (movements that need to be shown in such a list), that the Ventures pick only half covers, PLUS, with the beautiful ‘Warmth of the Sun’ (to me their most beautiful pre-PET SOUNDS track) covers that side too. In short, it’s doing two things, where PET SOUNDS would only do one. The thing about great, great records, they often don’t offer as many styles or avenues as transitional records do. SHUT DOWN VOL. 2 is a transitional record in their career, it’s straddling both, and as such has over time suffered (incorrectly) for it.
The same thinking then touches the NIN THE FRAGILE pick; Ministry’s THE LAND OF RAPE AND HONEY covers everything THE DOWNWARD SPIRAL does (and then some; it goes into more metal avenues—if I wanted to use NIN here I’d actually do the BROKEN ep to be honest), while THE FRAGILE starts moving in more directions that rock has seen it its wake. Plus, if I’m being subjectively honest, THE FRAGILE is, to me, easily Trent’s towering masterwork. Listen to the new vinyl remaster, it’s tremendous and then take a dip into the DEVIATIONS 1.0 disc just released (it’s outtakes and different versions) and you get the entire scope: THE FRAGILE is nearly 3 hours of beautiful, art rock, touching on dozens of styles.
While this is not necessarily a 50 greatest records, I feel any of the 100 I’ve listed are great. ‘Greatest’ is a more subjective measuring, while this idea, though subjective in what I think could represent certain styles, has more objective aims. Plus, since I’m always trying to be socialistic in my political cultural bent I tried to order the ‘class’ in such a way that the students would see the form also being made by women and blacks, rather than the predominance of white guy guitar music that has dominated many such lists as these (Wanda Jackson over, say, Elvis, is one such pick. I’d assume an 18 year old freshman taking my class would already be familiar with Elvis works, while that Wanda Jackson record is tremendous).
Totally understand now. Commend you for thinking this through as you’ve got a more broad encyclopedic knowledge of the whole scope. I really don’t have the depth you do on many elements. I fully understand why you would choose Shut Down over Pet Sounds then. Transitional records do really get the shaft. They’re pegged as not fully formed, which is a shame as they’re often the seeds of ingenuity and experimentation. What is your placeholder for Emo?
At the Drive-In on the one list and Refused on the other. Granted, Refused are emo very remotely—but there is a definite whiff of Youth of Today on that LP so that’s what I’m attempting there (that Refused record just has a ton of styles so it’s useful).
I will say, so many questions initially where about the 50’s and 60’s (no doubt due to Tony and Sam being more interested in the era of their youths) but you and Maurizio have highlighted the real difficulty in attempting to cover what the 80’s – 2000’s splintered into. It’s the most chaotic and explosive era in many regards, with dozens of genres and subgenres existing, often with great bands that ONLY do that style (so overlapping, ‘transitional’ records are more difficult to come by). I also had a strict ‘no comps’ policy of labels or eras (I did allow artist compilations within reason, as many early players are only really available in that way).
I’m currently reading ROCK AND THE POP NARCOTIC by Joe Carducci, that is a long rant by what sometimes amounts to a crank, but he’s also tremendously brilliant and outlining how rock n’ roll as a form—an aggressive one—was completely maligned by the mainstream powers that be in this great era so much so that the albums we often use as signposts are really second or third generation pop echoes of the sound/niche. It’s a lot harder to nail down then really anyone knows.
I could probably wipe the 80’s onwards from either list and keep retrying and never be 100% happy.
When I bought Relationship of Command I never lumped it into emo, but it does appear that the references out there do give it some emo cred. Elements yes but for me probably not hitting it smack on, which isn’t what you’re really going for anyway, what with trying to hit more than one genre at once if possible. That is true about signpost albums being pop representations of a sound. I’m as big a Nirvana/Cobain fan as you will find, but Nevermind happened during Grunge and associates with but does not define the Seattle sound and is in fact a 3rd-4th generation grunge record of sorts so really doesn’t deserve a spot on this list. I actually consider In Utero superior in several ways. Your Mudhoney and Green River picks are more 2nd gen. Malfunkshun is also a good reference point, but Andrew Wood’s tendency was rather erratic, so not sure I’d site it as an essential top 50 record for this list.
Emo I struggled with; many of the seminal records in the genre I love are straight emo/hardcore without a second or third genre that I can use; Rites of Spring, Drive Like Jehu etc. So I hoped that a I could cover with with a math rock(ish crossover). As I’ve said, it’s all very hard in the last three decades (I don’t feel Madchester or rave/electronic/dance is represented well enough either…).
Yeah I tried to sweep grunge pick in with sludge/doom, with means I probably should have looked to the Melvins, instead of Mudhoney, but I do think the early Mudhoney is pretty darn sludgy. It starts to become WHAT genres I feel are in need of covering over others.
I’m right with ya on Nirvana; IN UTERO is my favorite work from their catalogue.
Great piece Jamie. I personally would add something that includes country rock into the equation…. Grievous Angel by Gram Parsons, After The Goldrush by Neil Young, Trace by Son Volt, The Gilded Palace Of Sin by Flying Burrito Bros. One of those would be acceptable. Or maybe just throw in Blonde On Blonde by Bob Dylan.
I’m in general agreement with many of the choices you make (though I naturally may change some artists or pick different albums by those chosen) I would also probably replace Ministry with Throbbing Gristle when it comes to Industrial.
Good stuff…
Yep, any list such as this would need to show country rock somewhere in it. Many of the 50’s picks start doing this, but you’re speaking more in the alt-country tag, so I attempted it in other ways; my first list has The Everly Brothers, HEARTACHES AND HARMONIES (1994), which contains their version of Mickey & Sylvia’s ‘Love is Strange’ that, in 1965, is as country rock infused as anything the Byrds, Graham Parsons, et al did. Plus, that compilations has highlights from their country rock LP, 1968’s ROOTS. Around that same time, the Beau Brummells did country rock (and other styles) on INTRODUCING THE BEAU BRUMMELLS, so I felt adding additional records for that sound would be redundant. The second list does these ends by having the Byrds seminal MR. TAMBOURINE MAN and the KINKS highly underrated MUSWELL HILLBILLIES. Then, later, BIG STARS’ THIRD RECORD sort of picks over the carcass of the sound (while also adding some atmospheric futurism which let me include it while not being redundant).
Though, one version of these lists at one time contained Green on Red’s GAS FOOD LODGING (1983) which beats Sun Volt to the punch by almost a decade. If you don’t know it I can’t recommend it enough (it’s on spotify), the track, ‘Sixteen Ways’ is worthy enough, it’s tremendous.
Thinking of a few other sub genre offshoots that could be added, but weren’t due to space restraints or other factors….
Post Rock: Millions Now Living Will Never Die-Tortoise
Alternative Country: I See A Darkness-Bonnie Prince Billy
No Wave: No New York Compilation
Garage Rock: Here Are The Sonics
Ska Punk: The Specials
Math Rock: Spiderland-Slint
Psychobilly: Songs The Lord Taught Us-The Cramps
Slowcore: Things We Lost In The Fire-Low
Some of these are included; Ska sees representation on the Desmond Dekker LP—though it predates the Specials by about a decade, it’s that sound, plus the Clash’s SANDINISTA! has several tracks in the vein. Garage rock, being one of my favorite sub-genres sees overlap in MC5, AFTERMATH (Rolling Stones) and the Who’s pick. Plus, that CA Quintet LP on one of the lists covers a TON of styles (which was why it was included), garage rock being one such record (it can be listened to in its entirety on youtube, I can’t recommend it enough as it’s a true lost masterpiece).
That No Wave comp. was on one version of this list, and would be a GREAT addition (I hoped the Swans’ COP or Flipper’s GENERIC would approach it enough). Math Rock/Prog has several attempts, in the era you speak At the Drive-In or Refused comes closest. Full on psycho-billy, yes, perhaps two hip hop LPs from the late 80’s aren’t necessary (Public Enemy OR Boogie Down Productions…), though much of manic rockabilly is in the originals—thats why I went for the Jerry Lee Lewis live record—it’s an insanely manic record. Not psycho-billy per se, but it’s certainly a Psychotic hillbilly playing rockabilly….
As for slowcore, yep, I’d need a transitional record; I’m hoping the Boards of Canada LP can do A LOT for me in this era. Same for the Greenwood selection.
But, I don’t want to gloss over the fact that you list Bonnie Prince Billy—a person I’ve discovered in the last 5 years or so. Tremendously brilliant and incredibly dark, he’s something of a rural American Nick Cave. Should be a lot more known.
I saw Will Oldham perform back in 1997 when I was in college. He was touring for an album he released back then called Arise Therefore (one of my least favorite actually). He played at the Knitting Factory, and I considered his live show lacking. I’ve heard he has become much better performing shows these days. But yeah he’s got a bunch of great albums like Joya, Viva Ultra Blues, Ease On Down The Road, and the one already listed. Plus he’s an actor (I’m sure you know that but others might not) who has appeared in Matewan, Old Joy, and A Ghost Story to name a few.
Yep Maurizio, I do indeed know him in those films.
Hey Jamie,
Still trying to understand some things….what are The Smiths representing? Post Punk? Jangle Pop? Brit-Pop?
You have Bikini Kill on one and PJ Harvey on the other…are you saying they are interchangeable here?
I guess my point being it would help me understand the thought process if you listed the genre elements that each is representing that way I know what genres you are attributing to each record and therefore what has been included or left out in your mind. I don’t expect you to add them at this point as it’s a lot of work.
Well it’s really hard to just do straight swaps; I sort of started with the 50’s in each case and as I selected each pick it created an inverse domino effect. So as each pick gets slotted in place, holes emerge differently. If you looked at the first 15 picks of each list, different areas/genres are covered and others not. The idea of the challenge is how amoebic it is; it’s not listing the 50 sub-genres I feel are best in need of being represented, it’s like thinking about all these different tones, era, movements and finding the right mix of 50 to cover it all (or as much as possible).
So, for your two questions; Yeah I think the 80’s overall had a (re)birth of the guitar band, whether it was jangle, ‘indy’, or whatever, I wanted that shown. I thought the Smiths were good as they got at this quickly (and covered political overtures as well).
The first lists gets at this idea sooner by doing Wire (who cover a lot of the bases) coupled with Suicide. So that by the time the Style Council is selected I’m able to only slightly touch on it (while getting the blue-eyed soul/dance stuff covered a little). While the second list waits and only really gets to these ideas until the 80’s (save the Pere Ubu pick). OMD does what Suicide did, but is more poppy, so something like Style Councils dance is sort of redundant. The Smiths then where picked for their more straight guitar idea—and Marr’s country western picking (a trait often overlooked on his bag of tricks; but if you listen to the medley of ‘His Latest Flame’/’Rusholme Ruffians’ on RANK you understand easier).
The Bikini Kill and PJ Harvey are closer in idea to being straight swap ins—90’s feminist boom. PJ Harvey sits on the second list because the dominos have fallen with Green River coming earlier (and the class would’ve started in a feminine bent by having the first pick being Sister Rosetta Sharpe) a relatively straight grunge band; while the first lists needs Bikini Kill because Mudhoney sort of typifies the 90’s but that is just as much a sludge record as a grunge one (is there a difference? maybe) picked so I liked the idea of Bikini Kill giving me some additional potential to discuss the boom of 90’s underground—it was Kathleen Hanna that planted ‘Smells Like Teen Spirit’ into Cobain’s head after all.
Plus, overall I’m making a slight nod to wanting to show the Rock n’ Roll canon, which though I feel is interchangeable with ‘Pop’ in easiest terms, there are subtle differences and when I feel I couldn’t cover something with only 50 picks I tried always putting the preference of trying to cover Rock n’ Roll over Pop.
So, really, it’s a hard question(s) to answer as one pick dictates another and after, say 30 picks there is so many variables.
I mean here’s a quick thing:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rock_genres
Try to cover as many as you can (while weighing certain ones more importantly over others where appropriate) in 50 records.
Any opinion on this current group Jamie? I rather like them myself.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Decemberists
Not really, no. Not that they aren’t famously successful and even often sort of interesting, they just aren’t my bag at all. I don’t like making huge sweeping generalizations, but if I had to on them, I’d say something like, “I don’t generally like the twee/precious indy scene at moment” (Fleet Foxes, Decemberists et al). I wanted to—their name references an important piece of Soviet Socialist history and they are enough like Arcade Fire (a band I like several records from), and I’ve tried, just can’t get into it. For some reason I can’t get over that I want them to be rawer and more raucous—like Neutral Milk Hotel. Maybe I should try again….
I get why you’d really like them; THE CRANE WIFE is essentially a Jethro Tull album for the millennial set. Do you have a particular favorite you like best? I’d revisit.
My favorite, as you predicted, and for the correct reason largely to boot is THE CRANE WIFE! I have seen the group twice in concert and they are especially effective live methinks. I also like THE KING IS DEAD and HAZARDS OF LOVE, the albums that immediately followed THE CRANE WIFE.
I will say, like most fans of raucous, urgent rock n’ roll music that often sways into outright feedback drenched noise, prog isn’t my favorite of genres. I’m nevertheless somewhat well-versed on it (my father, for example is/was a fan of 70’s prog so many of my earliest ‘serious’ listens when I was discovering the form where in these areas), but outside of a few choice Jethro Tull records (Thick as a Brick) don’t consider the more pastoral strains of prog to be my preferred choices in the subgenre. I sway more to the near heavy metal side; something like King Crimson’s Red or, in a much more current, mainstream band, the work of Tool (whom I adore immensely).
To me, if you go down this path you should REALLY go down this path; it’s why when I want to do a prog record I do Van Der Graaf Generator, Genesis’ Lamb Lies Down on Broadway, or Magma. Magma, who invented a language to sing in, are virtually an island unto themselves, and the closet thing rock n’ roll has to genuine Wagner-esque tunes. It’s like prog rock even for prog rock. The Jethro Tulls and especially the Decemberists seem like mere childs play in comparison. I wonder if you know a few of Magma’s landmark mid-70’s records? If not you should check ’em out. You might see the beauty there.
I will definitely investigate Magma, in fact I’ll go on now and give some songs a listen. Another reason why I love Tull is that I grew up with them, and their prime period was during my most prime period of all listening to this music. Yes without a doubt THICK AS A BRICK is their greatest accomplishment, and still one of my favorite albums ever, though I will always hold out a light for the somewhat under-appreciated A PASSION PLAY. But I will hear some Magma.
Be slightly warned: Magma is nearly out reaches for 70’s Prog Rock. They’re tremendous, as I said the closest rock n’ roll gets to Wagner. But they aren’t nearly as commercial in the genre as something like Jethro Tull, who had several top 40 singles.
Their records are meant to be listened to like your classical pieces or operas, as complete things unto themselves in absorbing attentive sittings (so sampling a track here and there isn’t optimal). I know you approach music this way very often so it shouldn’t be hard, but it’s nevertheless a caveat I give when I recommend them.
Start with 1973’s Mëkanïk Dëstruktïẁ Kömmandöh, and then 1974’s Köhntarkösz. I have both if you need assistance.